User blog:Crimson Storm Mich/Analysis of In game mechanics

Ever wonder how certain mechanics work? Well here's an analysis by one person from AI (Talukita). You can read it here if you don't want to read my version (which is pretty much the same thing lel)

http://appinvasion.com/threads/analysis-in-depth-look-for-atk-down-convert-and-various-other-game-mechanics.283692/

http://appinvasion.com/threads/analysis-sol-creator-not-always-the-best-option-for-2nd-sphere-slot.240424/

ATK Down
A new mechanic starting from Fiora and Ardin. One would assume that 50% Atk Down means 50% damage reduction right? The truth is much more complicated than you think. Here's Eltri's Eternal Zephyr attack without mitigation on the left and Eternal Zephyr with Atk Down on the right. You can check the damage Ardin receive, from 137 -> 102. Clearly this isn't -50% damage.

Remember how %ATK buff works? ATK down is basically the reverse version of ATK buff. In other words it works additively by adding a -50% to the total modifier. With normal attack it is indeed a 50% damage reduction. With a 200% damage skill, it becomes 25% reduction instead. Once again similar to ATK buff, the higher the modifier, the lower the effectiveness of ATK down.

In the pics above, Eltri was using a special move with % modifier higher than 100%, it's the reason why -50% ATK down doesn't make it deal 50% less damage. And this isn't even a powerful attacks yet. Want to see how ATK down fares against a massive skill instead?

In Ushi's Vargas test, he attempted to use Vargas UBB (100% chance to -80% ATK) on Maxwell Endless. To his surprise, despite -80% ATK and mitigation, his units still take a massive amount of damage. Making him believe that Endless is a fixed damage attack (yes ATK down has zero effect on fixed damage skills)

However seeing how each unit of his receives a different amount of damage (Dia takes almost x2 damage compared to Darvanshel because of her low DEF), this is definitely NOT a fixed damage attack & ATK down is certainly in effect.

According to datamine, Zevalhua final form Endless has +250% multiplier, which means that it will deal 350% damage total. Let's just say this case applies to Max's Endless as well.

So a -80% ATK down will make 350% damage => 270% damage. 270/350 * 100 = around 23% damage reduction.

Yes, the highest ATK down effect in the game, on a UBB that requires 5-6 turns to fill + some other requirements only give you around 20% extra damage reduction. A normal -30% ATK down mean less than 10% reduction, AND they only have around 30% chance to apply. Just... eww.

Another painful fact is, since both ATK buff/down works additively, ATK down gets cancelled, HARD by ATK buff. A 50% ATK down basically gets thrown out of the window if the boss gets a +50% ATK up. Surely it still technically reduce the damage since the boss doesn't deal more damage now, it is still relatively annoying since you only have only a small chance to apply ATK down while ATK buff is up for basically all the time.

That said, ATK down still has its use, and I will cover it more in the DEF part. Just don't overestimate the effect of ATK down, but don't underestimate it either.

For me, the strategy of picking ATK down is when you can make use of its main buff, for example: In other words, if the boss is immune to Injury, or if you somehow can't make use of the element buffs, don't try to bring Ragshelm/Ardin/Fiora just because of the ATK down. The only exception is Belfura is because she has it on her very BB.
 * Kira: 60% crit buff + powerful Dark/Light + 30% chance to - 30% ATK/DEF
 * Ragshelm: 18% mass Injury buff + 25% chance to - 25% ATK/DEF down 2 turns (this is excellent because it leaves you a gap to reapply the ATK down effect if you miss it for a turn. -25% is enough to deal with chip attacks which is the true purpose of ATK down)
 * Ardin/Fiora: Dual elements buffs + ATK down.

Also, make sure that it is a fight that you can spam it. I tried using Ragshelm against Eze GGC and I think I was only be able to apply it once through the whole fight despite already using it every 2 turns. It is one of the major reasons I despise Zevalhua too much, offering nothing aside from damage and ATK down if you don't use her LS.

What about DEF down? Let's just say this is one of the most worthless buffs EVER! Poor Len, having so much potential only to get Gimu'd so hard.

Boosts ATK relative to DEF/REC/HP
Another new mechanic that has a lot of misconception. Well not that new since it already exists in ... Bahvel but no one bothers to use him even to know lol.

Anyway, it seems like Priscilla's SBB still does not work properly yet so I will use Ushi's test for this case instead.

Let's start with her normal BB damage: Base ATK 2154, 250% BB modifier, 115% ATK buff (Michele), 100% Wicked Blade, 100% Brute + Ore, Dual Maxwell = x14 multiplier => 2154 * (1 + 2.5 + 1.15 + 1 + 1) * 14 = 200537

As you can see, the formula checks out with only a small difference gap due to max/min damage. Now let's move to her BB damage WITH the REC convert buff.

His Priscilla with Malice has 2195 REC, so the base REC should be around 2195/1.3 = 1690.

He has Wicked Blade but I will only use base value to safely measure it. Expected formula for most people is this: (2154 + 1690 * 0.7) * (1 + 2.5 + 1.15 + 1 + 1) * 14 = 310674



However even when using base REC only, the expected damage is still off the chart compared to the testing result. Why? It's because the actual formula is this:

[2154 * (1+ 2.5 + 1.15 + 1 + 1) + 3380 * 0.7] * 14 = 233611 Note: The 3380 is 1690 REC x2 because of Wicked Blade

In other words, %convert does NOT convert other stats to your base ATK (and therefore doesn't raise the value of ATK buff and receive benefits from %BB/SBB modifier). It is just another type of ATK buff but based on other stats instead and stack upon normal ATK buff. Disappointing? Hell yes, yes it is. Furthermore, currently most %convert buff is for self only, AOE convert only exists in UBB which is too impractical, while Balgeos lowers your team DEF which is lol worthy. So yeah very gimmick mechanic right now, one of the reason why Priscilla is non existent in JP.

Lexida and +Hit Count effect
To make it simple: Lexida doubles your normal attack hit count/damage. If your final attack damage to a target deals 1000 damage, it will provide a 1000 damage clone = 2000 for total.

Since the x2 effect is put at the end for the damage formula (aside from spark), it calculates after you receive %ATK buff, meaning that the value from that ATK buff will also gets doubled.

With enough +%ATK, it's possible to deal more damage than your own SBB even due to this x2 effect. Some tests: Left - Rowgen with no sphere

Center - Rowgen normal attack with 2 Zurg lead (+200%), Michele buff (+115%) and Brute Elixir (+50%). Theoretically I should deal around 2k3 x (1 + 2 + 1.15 + 0.5) x 2 (Lexida) = 21390 damage. Yup, 11k x 2 = 22000 damage

Right - Now Rowgen SBB with Zurg lead, Michele buff. Should be 2300 x (1 + 6.2 + 1 + 1.15) = around 21505 damage



In the SBB test sure he doesn't have another Zurg lead + Brute, but keep in mind that this is Rowgen we are talking about with 620% bonus modifier (compared to the average 400-450% for normal units) which compensates for it.

Interesting? Definitely, however before it is more of a fun mechanic/interaction, mostly because you either usually spam your BB/SBB, and you can have only one Lexida to boost anyway.

Then Selena 7* appeared, with an UBB that gives Lexida effect TO YOUR ENTIRE TEAM. It is even more hilarious that her buff stacks multiplicatively with x2 hit spheres, which mean quadruple the hit/damage. Tests from JP

What makes it so good, is that you can build a complete sustainable Water team, with all kinds of buff, and when your OD gauge is filled you can unleash Selena UBB and deals a MASSIVE amount of damage to a target. This is extremely useful when you wants to delete a certain threat quickly (say... Vargas in Seria trial), or burst someone before they get to a certain %HP mark (avoid special moves and such).

Anyway, ATK (most important) and Crit buffs are your best friends if you want to try the build out. Spark doesn't seem to work really well here, mostly because your attacks get splitted out too much (for example Selena with Lexida + UBB deal 48 hits for total). That and the clone hits appear extremely fast making it very hard to spark. Also Eliza is pretty good in this case, having 80% ATK buff + 40% crit buff, on top of being Water and farmable so you can pick Anima type for her.

This is even better in Global with the existence of Halloween spheres (though I am not sure how it interact with the penalty part because this doesn't exist in JP for testing). Sure no %HP, but if you are lucky enough to grab Animu 7* units then when maxed just with Ihsir/Magic Device in slot 2 they can still have a hefty amount of HP (yes this means the value of none %HP spheres are raising as well, especially Lafdonia/Edea sphere)

HC manipulation
This is a mini update about manipulating HC distribution. While simple, it seems like there are still many people who are unaware of this.

So what's the deal? Before I noticed that HC generally flies toward units with lower HP more, however after some testings, there are only 2 rules when it comes to HC distribution:

1. Units who have their HP full: Similar to how you can not put Cure on a unit with HP full, HC will not be distributed to them as well, and this rule is absolute.

2. Units who don't have their HP full: This is however a complete different story. Units whose HP gauges are not full will absorb HC, and it's basically full RNG reliant. A unit who loses 1 HP can just eat as many HCs as someone who loses 10k HP. There is no such concept that the former unit will only absorb 1 HC, get fully healed, and leave the rest HCs for others.

In this meta that one tries to stay away from pure Healer as much as possible (aside from Elimo 7* maybe since she is so god damn good) and usually rely on HC to heal, knowing how to manipulate HC can be quite helpful sometimes.

The first way to cheat is via Drain effect. Since drain HP absorbs kick in before HCs distribute, if unit gets fully healed with the HP drain then rule 1 will apply and prevent him from receiving HC.



In the left pic for example. my Exvehl and Arus both lost their HP. In the right pic, After attacking, due to Arus having Leomurg equipped, he absorbs HP back to full.



Since everyone in the team is at full health aside from Exvehl, he will now fully absorb all the HC to himself = guarantee heal.

This makes Leomurg even better than it already is. It has 30% HP/DEF which are the 2 most relevant stats from a sphere, +BB gauge when attack for easier time at begin and the ability to cheat heal for others. A team with 2 Leomurgs (1 from friend) + Feeva (self drain extra skill) means that your team HC production essentially doubles sometime, since HC will now distribute to 3 units instead of 6.

What about Lexida? Sadly the heal here happens after collecting HCs so it doesn't work, it however does relieve you from lots of stress when it comes to healing this unit since you know he will receive a decent heal at the end.

A setup with something like: Unit 1 (Leomurg) + Feeva (self drain + heal when damaged) + Unit 3 (Lexida) + Unit 4 (Seria Trial sphere in 2nd slot) + Unit 5 (Star of Hope) + friend (Leomurg) can probably heal consistent enough even against hard single target boss with just HC. Play your cards properly.

Another way to do it is obvious via Cure. Sometimes with this knowledge, it's better to put Cures on a unit to fully heal him and let others absorb more HC than wastefully distribute to your Cures to multiple units but don't fully heal anyone. Once again using Cure effectively can be very helpful sometime.

Sol Creator as a second sphere
This analysis will discuss why Sol Creator (+15% boost to BC drop rate) can be a BAD choice for a second sphere slot.

I. BC Formula
Just in case, you may need to know about how BC mechanic in this game works in order to understand this analysis easier.

BC Drop Rate (%) = (Base + Inherent Drop Rate Bonus + Unit Buff + Item Buff + Sphere 1 + Sphere 2 + LS 1 + LS 2) * (1 - Enemy BC Resistance / 100) * Overkill Multiplier

Where:
 * Base Value. 35%. This can change in FH, but apparently that function is still unused.
 * Inherent Drop Rate Bonus. This is a stat inherent to some BB and SBB, but usually 0%.
 * Unit Buff. The currently active BC drop rate buff from a unit's BB or SBB. Only one can be active; newer buffs delete older buffs.
 * Item Buff. The currently active item drop rate buff. Again, newer buffs delete older buffs.
 * Sphere 1/2 (note: 1st and 2nd sphere if exist). Bonus from equipped spheres.
 * LS 1/2. Bonus from equipped LS. Note that some LS are only active during sparks.
 * Enemy BC Resistance. A hidden stat that enemies can have. We're yet to find a case of it being used, however.
 * Overkill Multiplier. This is x2.0 to all drop rates (not just BC) but only present on hits that land after the target hits 0 HP.

II. Diminishing Returns
BC Drop Rate (%) = (Base + Inherent Drop Rate Bonus + Unit Buff + Item Buff + Sphere 1 + Sphere 2 + LS 1 + LS 2) * (1 - Enemy BC Resistance / 100) * Overkill Multiplier

As you can see in the formula, %BC buff stacks additively, and anything that stacks additively will have diminishing returns effect.

A well known example of this is ATK buff:
 * With your normal ATK (100%), a 100% ATK buff really doubles your damage output
 * However if your SBB has 500% total damage multiplier, that 100% ATK buff now only increase your damage by 20% effectively.

%BC buff works in this similar manner: The first situation gives people the false illusion that is "Holy wow this sphere is amazing it increases my BC drop by a ton" (which is true) but eventually lead to scenario 2.
 * If you don't have any % BC drop rate and only relies on your base (35%), a 15% bonus from Sol Creator makes you drop around 43% more BC on average, so very good yes.
 * However with Zelnite as leader and his buff, you will have 35% + 15% + 18% = 68% BC drop before using Sol. Adding it now will only give 22% increase in average BC drop. Compared to the first example, its effect gets reduced by almost 50%.

Surprisingly, this is not the main reason that kills the viability of Sol Creator.

III. Max %BC drop rate
Like ATK buff, even with its diminishing returns effect, more is always better, and 20% or even 10% increase in DPS is still quite something.

% BC drop rate actually suffers from another problem: it can NOT exceed 100% drop rate, no matter how much do you stack.



In this pic, Mossy has:
 * 35% BC base BC drop
 * 40% BC innate drop from BB
 * 12% BC drop rate from Zelnite LS
 * 25% BC drop rate from Holy Flute
 * 38% BC drop rate from Tengu BB

The total is: 35 + 40 + 12 + 25 + 38 = 150% BC drop rate. Mossy has 5 max drop checks on his BB, and as you can see even with the ridiculous amount of BC drop rate he still can't produce any more than 5.

In other words, in certain situations, adding Sol Creator is completely useless. Unlike ATK buff where it still gives a decent DPS boost despite the diminishing effect, Sol gives NOTHING if you reach the cap.

Similarly, stop bringing Flute and waste an item slot if your team has 2 Zelnites as lead with Sol and such.

IV. Elza LS vs. Zelnite LS
Which is better? I will make it quick: Elza, and by that I mean A LOT.

The reason is because Elza LS makes the BC you receive, become x1.5 worth, Zelnite LS is just another + 18% to the BC drop rate formula, which similar to Sol Creator case: it has a cap.

Take this image as an example again. Zelnite LS in this situation is completely worthless since it does nothing, makes it 10 times stronger and Mossy still can only drop 5 BC max. Elza LS on the other hand can make this 5 BC becomes 7.5 BC worth, and it doesn't have any restriction. The more BC dropped on the floor, the better it multiplies.

Elza LS also doesn't receive diminishing returns effect and will always be a x1.5 multiplier compared to Zelnite LS where it keeps falling the higher you stack.

So yes, Elza LS >>>>>>> Zelnite LS (aside from Arena where they evenly match). The only reason you should pick him over Elza when you already have one Zelnite in your squad is that you are desperated for his extra HC and 8 BC fill.

The factor of BB Fill Rate bonuses also stacking additively means if they ever become prevalent on spheres or as a BB buff, the same argument can be made in favour of Zelnite in that scenario - it comes down to striking a balance. There are BB Fill Rate spheres, and they're coming close to being on the same level as Sol Creator for individual units - we're looking at it being better to strike a balance than investing solely in one form of BC increase. For example, if you have one Elza + Zelnite's SBB, the optimal second leader slot is actually... Zelnite.

Elza + Elza + Zelnite SBB: 2.0 * 0.5 = 100% BC Elza + Zelnite + Zelnite SBB: 1.5 * 0.68 = 102% BC Elza + Elza wins if you use a different BC drop rate unit or load your squad out with Sol Creators, but with just these effects...

As we get more options for BB fill rate spheres, and the potential for Alim to decide to add a BB fill rate buff, we're looking at more scenarios like this where the player has to decide what's ultimately actually the better option for the squad. Plus, Zelnite's got a ton of other benefits.

Secondly, depending on your requirements, having more raw BC drop instead of multiplying their value can be important. It reduces the RNG factor on distribution - as there are more rolls to determine which units get BC, the end result is more likely to be close to the true average than if you purely rely on BB Fill Rate multipliers.

Obviously there are scenarios where Elza's preferable, like if you're carrying plenty of BC drop rate increases already, but there are arguments in favour of Zelnite (and the distribution factor means he's arguably only worse in arena due to his lower personal BC gen and stats - increasing the total raw BC to reduce RNG variance is important to arena squads).

V. Alternate Options
So yeah... now that you know Sol isn't alway the way to go, what are the other choices? Here are some of the options for you to pick:
 * Havoc Axe or crit line spheres. Even when you are not running Maxwell one shotting squads, these spheres still add a lot to your overall DPS in the long run. One thing I need to mention that future bosses have special attacks (usually one hit kill) and will use it more if you drag out the fight too long. So more damage is also a way to survive as well.
 * Spark spheres. Same reasons as above. Spark multiplies your damage by a tons without any cap as well, so more is always better.
 * Status inflicting spheres (which status depends on the bosses). No I'm not shitting on you. Despite the immunity, bosses still usually have 1 or 2 statuses weakness that you can inflict on, and you already know how lethal ailments are when they proc. I have seen certain team setups that abuse status ailments to clear Palmyna GGC without gems and they work.
 * Immunity spheres. So that you can use more flexible healers like Arius, Yuje or Tia and not just Tree, tree and tree.
 * Wise Mask (increase chance of being targeted). This sphere is actually quite under the radar I think. Say you enter a dungeon with the main boss is fire element. By putting WM on a strong water unit you can make him soak a lot of damage for other units especially if you also have earth units in your squad. In additions, more and more bosses are having scripted attacks that force you to use your revive. Putting this sphere on some one then uses Angel Idol on him so there is a high chance that he can tank the attack. Works excellent on Rashil for this reason, managed to tank Verduta 99k attacks 2 out 3 in some of my tests.
 * BC regen/%BB fill rate/-%BB consumption spheres. I think at some points I would rather these sphere on my Zelnite so that he can use his BB fill more frequently and still probably roughly the same amount of BC when attacks.

VI. Final Words
Ultimately, what a player should do for BC gen depends on their squad's requirements and the specific units more than anything else. Whether a squad actually needs more BC gen; whether a unit's base BC gen is so low it's not worth increasing it; whether a unit's fill requirement is so high it'd be better off with a BB cost reducing or BB fill rate increasing sphere to bring it in line with the rest of the squad to stabilize the BC requirements. The player has to work it out, either by theorycrafting or testing.